brotherpeacemaker

It's about our community and our spirituality!

Never Owned A Slave

little_rock_desegregation_1957

Lately, I have seen an uptick in the number of comments from people claiming to be white who are tired of black people’s victim mentality of blaming white people for every single thing that is wrong with the black community.  Simply because the dominant community forced black people to work for nothing for generations while white people accumulated wealth for generations, simply because the dominant community denied black people equal access to educational opportunities for generations, simply because the dominant community denied black people equal access to employment opportunities, does not mean that the dominant community is the source of all the problems of the black community.

It should be pretty obvious to anyone with just a cursory understanding of cause and affect that denying virtually an entire segment of the population from being able to participate in economic activity would lead to an economic retardation.  While the one group is actively being held back, others segments of the population are free to accumulate wealth and pass that wealth on to their future generations.  Since the black community unfairly suffered from a lack of opportunities for wealth, education, employment, and such, the black community needs just as much assistance for being made whole as we have had to make us subordinate and subservient and a fraction of our true potential.

The minute some people hear the suggestion that the black community deserves special consideration for having to endure truly significant instances of discrimination, a number of people roll their eyes in contempt.  These people are quick to say things like they never owned a slave or they have never done anything to purposefully harm black people so they owe black people nothing.  People in the dominant community really do like to employ the most simplistic forms of thinking when it comes to issues pertaining to the black community.

A few years ago I was visiting my mom’s house when her dog suddenly started barking and going ballistic.  The man next door’s family came to visit him and his grand kids were in the gangway between the houses getting my mom’s dog all excited.  They laughed and ran.  I followed them to the front of the house.  The parents were sitting on the man’s porch.  I told the parents that their kids need to quit tormenting the dog.  One of the kids got indignant and said that he didn’t touch that dog.  Nobody accused him or anyone else of touching the dog.  The denial of touching the dog was thrown out as a distraction from the issue at hand.  The children were tormenting the dog and touching the dog was not the only way the dog could be tormented.  The children had no business in the gang way.  The gate to their grandfather’s backyard was on the other side of the house.  What were they doing in the gangway if they weren’t bothering the dog?  They were trifling children.

The photo above shows one of the Little Rock Nine trying to go to Little Rock’s Central high school so many years ago.  The lone black girl was being hounded by a gang of white people shouting and cursing her, holding up signs saying that they didn’t want any black people at their high school.  These white people probably were thinking they never owned any slaves and never did anything to harm black people either.  Why were their hard earned school tax dollars being used to educate black people?

The photo below is of a gang of white people who probably never owned black people either.  There is no evidence in the photo that they lynched the black men in the photo.  Certainly not all of the white people were responsible for the deaths of the black men.  By this very simplistic logic there is no proof that they owe black people anything and therefore the black community needs to simply get over the fact that these black men have been lynched.  The black men in the photo are the victims, not the black community.  White people are simply enjoying the view.

But the fact of the matter is that every time a black person was injured by America’s institutionalized racism the entire black community suffered the cost.  The subjugation of a black man was meant as a message to the black community by the dominant community.  Every time a black person got the message that he or she was not welcome to challenge the social pecking order, that the black community will be held back against its will, people in the white community benefited.  Although individual white people may not have directly benefited from owning slaves or intentionally harming black people, many people in the dominant community benefited from other white people’s dirty work.

Nobody is asking individual white people to dip into their personal savings and write a check to black people.  So why do individuals insist on making the intellectually lazy leap that America’s institutionalized racism inflicted on black people is coming out of their pocket?  Nobody is asking you to pay but obviously you feel like you are losing out when a black person ask for equality.  You obviously feel a lot like the white people in that photo who saw working hard to keep black people from trying to go to a school that they didn’t deserve.

1930-lynching

Tuesday, January 27, 2009 - Posted by | African Americans, Black Community, Black Culture, Black People, Life, Racism, Thoughts

31 Comments »

  1. Two thoughts: the first one more comedic in nature: Did you purposely photoshop Forrest Gump out of the crowd in picture 1, or was this an accidental slight?

    Second thought. Now this is my personal opinion, and as for how many people I speak for, I don’t know. I offer no agenda, but merely some food for thought on this one. As you know, I harbor no ill will toward the black community, nor am I able to fully understand the personal and societally constructed mentality of the black community. The biggest thing I hear, and have pondered myself from time to time, is the issue of reparations. While having no family history of owning slaves, or any direct knowledge of outright hatred of blacks within the family tree (aside from my grandmother once commenting that a certain romantic interest of mine was of the wrong color, to which my mother who is normally very passive, had a few choice words to shut her mother-in-law up!), one in my position, I can see as using the argument that we did nothing to the black community. I also see its simplistic fault as well. But the issue of reparations can be very divisive, within all communities. You mention that noone is asking white individuals to dip into their own pockets, etc. But reparations is such a large issue, and if to be followed through with, would require the largesse of government to provide, via our tax dollars. Now, consequently these tax dollars are already being dug out of our pockets through payroll withholdings, so I suppose that outside of paper records, we really aren’t giving anything up. Besides of course, the natural cause of inflation for pushing forth more dollars into the marketplace with no backing, increasing inflationary costs, budget deficits and debts. And by doing so, would everyone participating within the system be paying on this, or would special figures be used to allocate the monies strictly from the dominant white community? Either way, it is my belief that, outside the company of certain definite hate-filled people, most people within the white community see an extra allocation of tax dollars being forfeited away from necessary programs that are already underfunded, to put this money into the hands of a chosen percentage of the population for wrongs committed by previous generations and people. And a bigger question after the fact would be, would the money really make a difference, or would it be like the majority of lottery winners, who spend it with reckless abandon, and end up worse off than before they won? In essence, what is the expected result of reparations, with respect to reality of our world today?
    Thanks for listening.

    Mookie

    Comment by Mike Lovell | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback Mike Lovell,

      I guess it depends on what people mean by reparations. I don’t think it’s a good idea to cut people in the black community a check. But because the black community has been intentionally and artificially held back for so many generations without the proper attention needed to be made whole, there should be extenuating circumstances for consideration to taken when creating social programs for the benefit of the entire community. We say that everyone should be treated equally and given the same consideration for opportunities. But you have one person who is the descendent from the family who owned one of the largest corporations in America that owned a number of slaves back in the day and living in the poshest of neighborhoods where funds for an olympic sized swimming pool at the elementery school is not a problem competing with people who go to school in districts where decisions have to be made whether or not to remove asbestos from the school or buy school books to replace the books purchased fifteen years ago. A lot of people think its unfair that we spend more dollars to set the neglected urban schools on par with the posh neighborhood schools. We call it Robin Hood school funding. Why can’t we distribute the funds more equitably considering it was the uncompensated blood, sweat, and tears of many black people that helped create that wealth?

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

  2. As a white man I’d like to ask a question. Why are white men so universally stupid? The answer is: because we have no incentive to stop being stupid. We have managed to so arrange the world that everyone else on Earth has to do our thinking for us. You all have to understand us, be aware of our needs, do all of the work we refuse to do and rush to comfort us if we feel disturbed. Not surprisingly, most of us like this arrangement just fine.

    We have the minds of children or psychopaths. When we berate you for “playing the victim”, we are really saying, “How dare you squirm while we stand on your neck?”

    OK, seriously, I was one of those people whose family “never owned a slave.” We were hardworking fishermen in the Canadian Maritimes. As far from the slave trade as you could get. Right?

    Turns out those Canadian fisheries were subsidized by the British Empire to provide a cheap protein source for the vast slave plantations of the Caribbean.

    My ancestors worked on ships called Grand Banks schooners, light fast sail powered fishing boats where cod could be salted and stored, then quickly transported south to the islands.

    You know that traditional Jamaican fondness for “salt fish”? Yeah, that was my great, great grandfather’s work. My people lived off of the slave trade for generations.

    For generations we were also members of the Anglican church. The head of the Anglican church, the Archbishop of Canterbury, oversees the church from an enormous complex of buildings called Lambeth Palace.

    We in the church do not like to hear it mentioned that, at one time, The Church of England was the largest slave holder in the British Empire. Lambeth Palace was built with profits gained by working literally millions of slaves to death at an early age.

    The fact is, when a great crime is perpetrated against humanity, the African slave trade, the destruction of the Native people of this continent, only a willing and deliberate fool could claim that there were no consequences involving their place in the modern world.

    Now, stop bumming me out with all of that playing the victim. I’m going to go pretend that I come from simple fishing folk who lived in a tiny harbor community and worshipped at a humble wooden chapel. Oh, and I worked hard for everything I have.

    Comment by Jon | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback Jon,

      Your story is a prime example of how owning a slave wasn’t the only contributing factor to the subjugation of the black community. Black people worked hard as well. Our ancestors and elders worked hard for things they, nor their children, never got.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

  3. Okay, I now more clearly understand where you’re coming from with these things. And I have to say you and I agree here. when we implemented a county/local sales tax option that was designed for school repairs/refurbishing, etc, the high schools for the most part got what they needed, but the lower level schools (middle/elementary) showed a disparagement in which schools got what funding, or were put on the delay until suddenly the funding dried up. Meanwhile, the School Board for the magnet city (Des Moines), facing budget shortfals left and right were still in the process of upgrading members office spaces in overly expensive downtown buildings, with plans for having certain ammenities if I recall correctly. Yet, certain schools were forced to do without necessary work, or closed down altogether, forcing students to be bussed to other schools across town. You can guess which neighborhoods lost their schools….the poor ones. This was one of the big factors, that came to my attention through news clippets in the paper and on local tv, in shaping my funding idea. To make a new source for funding (negating the participation of the backwards government locally and at the state level), to provide more equitable resource allocation for these schools that missed out, and so that the existing funding for certain things wouldn’t be a either-or discussion. Now I just have to figure out how to start, and then get my rear in gear.

    Comment by Mike Lovell | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

  4. Thank you. In defense of white people and our willful ignorance, this information is hard to come by. I didn’t know about the role of the cod fisheries in the slave trade. I found out a few years ago when I read Mark Kurlansky’s book, “Cod”

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0140275010/ref=cm_rdp_product

    That led me to read “Bury the Chains”, Adam Hochshild’s history of the English abolitionists.

    http://books.google.com/books?id=EXlYZdsdFGgC&dq=bury+the+chains&printsec=frontcover&source=bn&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=4&ct=result

    These are two very recent books. I thought I knew something about history until I read them. I’ve never come across any of this information before. If I sound sarcastic in my earlier comment, it’s to cover up the fact that I am still deeply angry and ashamed about the truth that I learned in these two books.

    I should also say that I had the privilege of meeting Randall Robinson. I read a couple of his books and I thought I understood and supported the idea of reparations.

    I thought that I was a real cool guy with a great progressive point of view etc. Despite all of that, I still imagined that I had not benefitted from slavery and racism except in the most vague and general way.

    Comment by Jon | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

  5. Just like the pictures that are from the past that is long gone, so is the argument. Some don’t want to accept responsibility for their own actions because that would mean that they would actually have to GET UP off of their OWN butts and do something with their lives. And if they dared to recognize that we are not living in 1948 anymore, then they would actually have to admit that no one is holding them down. Now, that would mean that there is no excuse not to be able to get up. No excuse…no help. Some of these people don’t want to do anything without help or aid because that’s what they’ve grown used to.

    If a child is bullied once, the teacher may give them special treatment for a day to make them feel better. Then again the second time. The child begins to like getting special treatment, so they then start to comprise stories out of nowhere, hence lying, just to get some special attention. That is, until the teacher catches onto the student’s scheme. Game over.

    It’s 2009, and we have a biracial President. It’s a good thing, because it has shown the whole country that none of us have an excuse anymore. Not just Black people, not just Latinos, but ALL of us don’t have an excuse anymore to be the best people that we can be.

    http://www.truthinthelies.wordpress.com

    Comment by House | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback House,

      But your argument today is the very same argument that the dominant community employed the day enslaved black people were set free, no one is holding you down anymore so you no longer have an excuse for the subjugation that you will endure for future generations. We now have a black president. But for every black president we have, how many black people do we have in prison? How many black people do we have unemployed? How many black people do we have that cannot obtain adequate medical care? It appears that the odds are still woefully against black people. True not all of us have may have an excuse not to succeed any more. But that doesn’t mean that racism has some how evaporated.

      It’s truly disgusting how some people want to pretend that the playing field is now level because a black man is president. Many of us feel the need to overlook racial discrimination and dismiss it as little more than a child being bullied. It’s just a picture of a forgotten past. That’s what many of us say as the black man is the one being shot in the back while he is on the ground with his hands in cuffs behind him. It’s forgotten as we see the statistics of disparity that constantly show black people suffering greater examples of discrimination. This is no game and it is far from being over. It won’t be over for a long time to come. You may think that you have arrived and therefore no black person has an excuse. But I prefer not to turn my back on other black people who may need help.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, January 27, 2009 | Reply

  6. It is a shame what happened years ago I will admit that. Now is a time of change though. I live and work
    in the D.C. area, which has a high population of blacks versus the average population. Through High School I have
    learned about Booker T. Washington, Harriet Tubman, Eli Whitney, Rosa Parks, the Tuskegee Airman and various other
    “African Americans”. You see that is the problem right there – African American, just as is the Black Community and any other term that differentiates anybody from the community we call America. We always seem to focus on our
    differences, rather then our similarities. Don’t forget the past just don’t dwell. I live less than 20 miles from the nations oldest housing project which is predominatly Black and is full of generations of familys who are victims.
    Maybe some of the help they are recieving is keeping them in
    the place where they need the most help getting out of.

    Comment by Diggs McGee | Thursday, January 29, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback Diggs McGee,

      But the fact that some people use the term African American isn’t the primary issue separating black people from white people. The term African American being described as divisive is merely a distraction and an excuse to dismiss the issues facing the African American community. The real issue that separates the black community or African American community from the racially generic dominant community that is predominantly white is that no matter how you examine social issues, black people or African Americans always come up on the short side of any measure. Maybe if we can get past the racial discrimination that has black people coming up short we can get past the use of such trivial things like the usage of the term African American.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Thursday, January 29, 2009 | Reply

  7. really..im very sorry but im abot toget ignorant i cant help it..if we are doin something..then what? what the fuck did i do that I owe you something..WHAT? what did i doo? i dont have a singal white friend..my gang only had 1 other white boy..my woman is a black woman..WHat do you think just cuz im white i have a perfect lil world and i can afford to help you with your problems just beacause your darker than me and your probly livin high rite now..do i have to spell it out? I LIVE IN A FUCKIN SLUM..i dont have time for helping out blacks or other whitees for that matter..YOU know if you had any contact with a real ghetto youd know that many white olks live there too! There are millions..probly almost as many as blacks! there are soo many poor “whites”..they dont have time for this shit they need to eat..didi you know that poor whites were persecuted tooin the past for being”tainted with negro blood” im tainted with negro blood…but im the color whited still..what do you want from me..to beat myself and appologise for being born white( being born at all)..soree for the ignorance but its how I feel..you know poor blacks dont want rich or well to do blacks represennting then cuz rich black have nothing in common with poor one..oh were similair in color..big deal..I have more in common with them then well to do blacks..Please explain

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  8. would yall be happy if i lynched myself?

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  9. THe truth is that it both white and black fault..if you hit your brother..and he hits you back..and you curse at him for it..whos fault is it.. both..even though he started it.THERE ARE BLACK RACISTS! and dont say its just cuz they kept down and try to make it out like evry black guy is a misunderstood good guy…Hate can come from any human being… As for “black” its not a race..its a color..same with whites..there are several sparate and distinc races that are distinguished in their own right and happen to have black skin..jamaican and nigerian people are similair in color..two very distinct races..and the 200 years that this country has doesnt give us the roots to be called races..most whites and blacks dont even know thier own roots….—————-

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  10. HOuse. there are three types of lie: lies, damn lies, and statistics..and we must remember the media loves controvesy
    and do play a big part in our view of society..they could cause mass panic if they want to

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback John,

      Yes I have to agree that black and white people need to work to stop this social discrimination. But relatively few people want to see this issue for what it truly is. People like to come to this blog and talk about how black people are just as culpable in this situation, but the same people never visit blogs that say black people are solely responsible for the conditions of the black community and say white people are just as culpable. Do you have any comments on other blogs where you condemn the behavior of discriminatory white practices?

      You wrote, “what the fuck did i do that I owe you something..WHAT?” Where the fuck did I say that John owes me something? You take this shit so personally that you don’t bother to see the forest for the trees. All you see is black people want to change things and now you feel that you owe. And it is this take shit personal attitude that keeps us from trying to solve problems. If you’re too busy living in your ghetto to try and make a difference then quit wasting your time coming here to try and justify the status quo.

      If lynching yourself makes you feel better then go right ahead. I don’t see how it will help the black community but we would have one less person wasting time with stupid questions. If you think the black community doesn’t deserve any changes then make your point and move on. Rhetorical questions are not helpful or appreciated. Nor are comments that we need to get out and bang some black women. If you want your comments to continue to be posted I strongly suggest that you act more civil. I don’t owe you anything either. Your comments are posted at my discretion. You might think about that before you say something that I may find offensive.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  11. “All you see is black people want to change things and now you feel that you owe” all i see is black people..never ..thats what im fighting right now, i dont see you as a buch of black people..your an individual..as for the banging black women..i only meant to say that if we all mixed then there wouldnt be a problem.. ..when you said in your article about us complaining that we dint owe dark ppl anything..i foolishley took it asy you saying we owe something..i will try to be more intelligent..i guess i appologise for the ignorance..lol..yoou cant expect me to
    be educated like you but ill try :).what do you mean status quo..what does status quo even mean (embarrassed alil asking)as for comdemning white practices..I agree that it is both our faults..and have beeen condemned in my new neighborhood enough-im trying to say i dont want you to not post read my stuff, because im confused now and coming to you for answers..i was only making a statement that if theres nothing i can do about the black problem THEN WHAT DO I DO?

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  12. Brother Peace Maker, I’ve been following this thread since my earlier comment. My goodness but even the faintest hint of the R(eparations) word certainly does get my white brothers riled up.

    I was once trying to explain the thinking behind reparations to a friend. He got angry and said, “You’re just trying to guilt trip me!”

    I said, “No that’s not what I’m trying to do. Are you sure you’re not feeling guilty about something?”

    What I will point out is that one percent of humanity owes more than eighty percent of the world’s wealth. I’m sure that one percent did not do more than eighty percent of the world’s work.

    Meanwhile, the people who do most of the world’s work are often the poorest people. Often they are people who are trapped in poverty by conditions that are beyond their control and beyond their ability to change.

    It’s fashionable to say that there is no point throwing money at a problem. Actually, poverty, ignorance and dispossession are problems that need money more than anything else.

    So where should that money come from? I think that one percent could remember the rest of us, their benefactors, in their wills. It seems right to start the recompensation with the children of the people who were paid nothing at all for their work.

    Finally, John, you ask, “WHAT DO I DO?” I would suggest that you be still (like it says in Psalm 46) and listen. Brother Peace Maker, is our host. We are guests here. He is only a man. He is not “Black People” or “Black Opinion”. He is certainly not “The Race Problem”. He is only a man.

    Nevertheless, he seems like a pretty good man. Why not enter into his house with some respect, put your heart at ease for a little while and listen to what he has to say. After that, you are free to form your own opinions.

    Brother Peace Maker, thank you for your generosity in making yourself available to this troubled world.

    Comment by Jon | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  13. jon..shut the hell up i never said that he is the “black opinion” and im not your white brother…where did I say that he is the black opinion..if you read all my other comments on the other articles..you realiz THAT I EVEN SAID THAT ITS WRONG TO CONSIDER YOURSELF FIRST AND FOREMOST A BLACK PERSON..AND THAT YOU SHOULD CONSIDER YOURSELF ONLY AND INDIVIDUAL..IDIDNT SAY HE WAS A BUNCH OF BLACK PEOPLE I EVEN SAIID ONE LINE “I DONT SEE YOU AS A BUNCH OF BLAVK PEOPLE< I SEE YOUAS AN INDIVIDUAL" I SAID THOSE EXACTWords. I Sat and raved on other blogs that separating the black and white community is wron and even the phrase "black community" is wrong…if you got to the other posts and read my history..i grew up with "black people" and I said I saw no difference between blacks and whites.. WHen I said this I was reemed By the Other BLog person That its wrong for me to see only an individual..not the color..I appreciate you trying to be a christian..but dont say things that I already said and make it out like you showed me the light…..and anybody who tryes to make it out like dark people arree sooo different that they should have their own "communit" or "white community" cannot have it all right..but when you say these things ppl get angry and act like blacks and whites are two very dignified races that are to be recognised as different..well they didnt grow up in a different culture they gre up in america…and i strongly disagree with any terms Like "the black community"…so dont tell me that he isnt the black point of veiw ..and that hes a man..i said that long before you did.

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  14. and then you sayin wow like i learned something new when i said all that before the man commented..That still dont solve the problem “be still” Ok bropeacemaker Ill stand still while all these problems you telling everybody still exist happens..how does this sound..bropeacemaker..stand still…I shared the same culture as my “black “brothers” as I call them..they had the same upbringing as I did…to distinguish between us because of color is wrong…to say that they have a diff culture is incorrect because you develope culture through upbringing not blood…THEY NEVER COMPLAINED ABOUT BLACK ISSUES..IN FACT THE ONLY “BLACKS” I HEAR COMPLAINING ARE THOSE WHO HAVE MONNEY!!! so no i wont stand still..Im 17 right now..I want everybody to shut the heel up and realize that we arent different because of color but who we are by the time that im in my 30’s at least..being raised in new orlans I WAS THE FRIGGIN MINORITY!! AND YOU KNOW WHAT? I DIDNT CARE I NEVER SAY A DAMN DIFFERENCE. I DIDNT GO AROUND THINKIN ABOUT ” OH Hes BLACK IM WHITE THaT MAKES US UNIQUE” AND I CERTAINLY DID’NT HAVE THIS STUPID IDEA THAT ONE HAS TO BE ” LOYAL” TO THERE RACE OR “COMMUNITY” and it seems that is being promoted to an extent. im off for now..ill be back though so you can try to tell this “Kid” some more obvious things instead of telling me how to solve your problem..because isnt that what this site is for?

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

    • John,

      I said “Wow” because I appreciate the positivity from Jon. Again, you are taking everything personally. You are not the subject of this blog. You are no more indicative of the entire white community as I am indicative of the entire black community. And you’re only seventeen? Please! What do you know about struggling to provide for a family? Seventeen? That explains a lot. You talk about how you grew up without prejudice. News flash: You’re still growing.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  15. I m not takin your article personally..but i was taking jons comment and telling him that i already know what he was trying to explain..you still havent told me how to help..what use if complaining if you havent told me how to help..Oh newsflash for you…i say grwon..because i had to grow up fast..and i HAVE been providing for my family since a young age.. tell me how does that explain alot? Im sure that ive been through enough to teach you a few thing! and now its age discrimination and steryotyping?! as for you..this article is not about you insulting me..this article was SUPPOSSED to point out a problem,..if you are going to point out a problem and say we need change.. i said how can I help..that is alot more than most ppl on your blog have offered,,allss everybody does on here is like Oh your right..and then you all get together and complain and im saying how can I help..how is that thinking the article is about me? Im not growing brother..i never had the childhood you did..so yes..i am in the truest since and adult..because i provide for my family and have taken charge of it from a young age..your being just as ignorant as I have been..I come here offering help..No wonder people think that “blacks ” want this to go on..its easy to mistake your failure to provide me with a task as a desire to continue on with this nonsense. oh by the way..dont ever try to pretend like you know my life and the level of maturity ive had to rise too …and dont ever try to cheapen the props ive earned again..that is a direct attack on me and its disrespectfull.Dont assume that i have no adult responsibilities…im not trying to make this about me..but im not willing to let you verbally take away all that i have done and accomplished and earned..If your a man..you will respect this…thank you…now tell me what should be done about this so i can spread the word..or tell me to get the hell off of your site and delete my posts….

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  16. Fact: adulthood is achieved with experience..deeds..and insight…not years..dont ever cheapen what ive done..and please dont ever directly disrespect me..i never disrespected you…how would you like it if i said that about you?

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

    • John,

      Adulthood is actually a combination of things. I believe most laws that apply to adults have a year count associated with them. Few laws list adulthood as a product of deeds. If you think you’re being disrespected it’s probably because you’re not mature enough to see the difference. I don’t believe it is stereotypical to consider teenagers such as yourself in need of more maturity. It’s rather ludicrous of you to suggest you’re being discriminated against. Even your email address, byproductofyeast, manifest your immaturity. You really need to take that chip off of your shoulder.

      You say you’ve had to grow up fast and that you could teach me a thing or two. You probably can. But I often learn things from my two year old son. I really don’t think that makes him my peer. Obviously you might feel differently. You are entitled to your opinion. Go get your own blog and talk about how much of a man you are. I really don’t give a shit. You want to know what you can do for the black community? Get off my back and start thinking of other people for a change.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  17. thinking of other people..Id give you the shirt off my back if you needed it.. I beleive adultu=hood comes with experience as there are many adults who are”kids” and as for my email..Ive had that since IO was ten and its the only adress my friends no.its not a proprer indicator of anything…I wasnt talking about my manhood untill you insulted it…I will leave..but i think its a shame that i just wanted to come and work out these misunderstanding ..that way i could understand your “black community” and that way i could help….i asked you for a direction..an exact way to help your community..remember..I was willing..I explained i was of limited means..it may have sounded like i was taking offense..but thats just the way i have developed as a person..you cant blame me for that.. TO conclude… I was willing to do whatever you said was best to help this community of yours Isnt that thinking of ppl? I was actually thinking of ppl moreso than the rest if these ppl cuz i offered to take action…it is you who turned me down ..Ill leave your site..with nothing more than bad feelings, hurt feelings too in a way. Just do me the favor of deleting my posts and ill be on my way to find someone who will actually tell me how to help rather than try to prove that im such an ass.. ps. i said deeds and insight and wisdom..not just deeds.. deeds are what cause us to have insight ..bye

    Comment by John | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  18. John,

    You have experience with certain aspects of life yes, which no one should or could cheapen. The problem is that you do not have some overwhelming plethora of life experience.

    You say that the only black people complaining are those with money. What difference does it make how much money the person has who is complaining? Maybe the poor people who you associate with are complaining just not to you. Or perhaps they aren’t complaining because of a lack of education, a lack of social awareness and/or too much of the kool aid. BrotherP and Jon, are obviously awake to the social ills of our society.

    If you come here offering help what help? You say you don’t know what to do. You make a lot of assumptions and do a lot of stereotyping. How does any of that help? It is extremely hard to converse with someone who is obviously incapable of distinguishing dialog with disrespect or “knowing ones life.” You have already spewed what type of life you have led. You also have made statements that have shown a level of immaturity that more than tells the level you’ve “risen” to.

    You say that you are not trying to make this about you, yet your whole dialog has revolved around YOU. YOU are here to help, what kind of life YOU have led, all the blacks YOU deal with daily, all the experience YOU have. All these things sound like its all about YOU. It is about American society which includes the black community, white community, Asian community, Hispanic community plus any and every other community you can think of. We are all still Americans.

    You might do better reading through the bulk of BrotherP’s post before you enter into a dialog about the issues. It might help you to get a better understanding of exactly what BrotherP’s thinking is. It is not an admonishment in anyway. It is just a suggestion. You are still young and there is nothing wrong with that. In fact you might do better reading the Dark Profit as he is about 18 and talks about these issues as well.

    Thanks.

    Comment by theblacksentinel | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  19. John, get your own blog.

    Comment by Jon | Sunday, February 1, 2009 | Reply

  20. Brother P,
    WOW, is right, on many counts. While I’m more apt to fuel the flames of some inane conversation as a cure to boredom, I seriously respect your patience with a young man like John. I’m pretty sure I would’ve cut things off about 23109847 of his comments ago. The problem I see with John’s methods here is a lack of clear communication. As many people do, and I’m sure we are all guilty of it from time to time, is that he seems to be focusing on small details (as you said, can’t see the forest for all the trees in the way), and making them problems, rather than expanding the vast metaphorical mindspace to examine the issue and actually search for the solutions.
    I too grew up poor. And truth be told, I was one of those “wiggers” growing up, as my redneck peers labeled me. Being a no-namer, I chose, rather than to just be me, to seek out a persona of power, and became the litte white gangbanger wannabe. I envied the lifestyle and power the message purveyed. Of course being a one man “gang” doesnt exactly offer a whole lot in either of those categories. On one hand I at least like to think I understand the plight of the subjugated black community, and yet on the other hand, I obviously can’t comprehend the magnitude of it. I understood the need to find solutions to things, but frustration of being poor and powerless can be overwhelming a lot of the time. One thing I always made sure to do, was to maintain my smarts and wit, for without that, I’m just another ignorant fool running his mouth at my own expense.
    At 17, I joined the military, I had already held fulltime jobs for 3-4 yrs prior to this, plus school and a paper route. I felt I was all around smarter than many of my peers, in common sense and intelligence, and in fact smarter than many of those so called adults. And yet, in many ways, almost 13 yrs later, and a father of 2, certain aspects of my life make me question my adulthood. In a way I am still very much a child, especailly compared with others. Some of it comes with age, and some comes with experience. But in all I do, I try to maintain a certain degree of civility and respect for those around me, regardless of opinions, status, etc.

    Comment by Mike Lovell | Tuesday, February 3, 2009 | Reply

  21. Brother P & Mr John,

    I’m seventeen years old and only a high school Black student. Despite this information, I’m well aware of these problems in the black community. I do agree that my people were damaged and scarred in the past and that it does affect us today. However, I don’t believe that “white people” are responsible for what we do “now”. I honestly think that we can come up out of the issues that affect our community. We’re just stuck in that “slave mentality”. What I mean by that, is we think we can’t do anything. We feel we can’t succeed and then only go for what seems easiest: drugs, gangs, low paying jobs, and dropping out of high school.

    Going back to the issue of “white people being responsible”, I strongly believe that ALL races, not just white, should help us. Not just the black community, but the hispanic community as well. We’re at the bottom of the food chain for crying out loud! ((Haha! I’m just trying to be real))If America is supposed to about untiy, abour “United We stand, Divided we fall”, then why are there only certain groups of people advancing, and others struggling? In my opinion, this country has fallen, and made it look like it’s up on its feet again.

    Just because Obama is President, it does not mean that the issues of race and the issues of the black community are gone. We need to get back up on our feet, but we need the help to get there. Not just from our own, but from others. Not saying everyone else needs to come out of the pocket while we sit back; WE ALL NEED TO WORK TOGETHER. Every color label and every ethnicity is unique and special in its own way. What makes us so special? We endured hardships. “So hasn’t everyone?” Yes, but how many people you know that have fought back and continue to fight back?

    Looking at history, I’ve found that this country was built on the backs of my people. By our blood, sweat, and tears America was made wat it is today.

    Funny how it seems when it comes to asking others to address these issues, we (meaning blacks) are now the racist ones seeking for attention. Can someone please explain to me how this is?

    I’m sorry for ranting and getting off topic, but when it comes to issues concerning my people and me, I get this fire of revolution running through my soul.

    That’s all I have to say. I just wanted to give you all a viewpoint from a black teenager’s POV

    Comment by Victoria Smith | Friday, March 6, 2009 | Reply

  22. would like to point out that Obama is just as black as he is white..

    People like to forget that because both sides are too busy pushing the “issue” of the black man.

    I will offer this as a white man who is a direct decendant of General Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson…… I judge all individuals based on their character and their actions. I have issues with a persons choices and not their skin color or ethnic background.

    The fact that people are “African”-American, “latino”-American, “Asian”-American…etc. is the true reason why us “white” people are tired of hearing it.

    I myself would be a “German, Spanish, Italian”-American if i thought in that way, and we will NEVER progress as a nation until we are all just AMERICANS!

    Victoria made a very poignant reference to the quote “UNITED we stand, divided we fall.

    The past is just that, and until efforts are made for a better tomorrow and not to repair the past, we will NEVER progress as the one thing that we ALL are:

    Americans

    Now this will be the part where I get corrected and ridiculed for my lack of compassion, and maybe even told that this attitude is the reason there is a problem in the first place. But to be honest with you, I don’t care at all about the hurt feelings of people who are no longer with us. I care about your future and my future and the future of our kids.
    One day we are going to have to realize that we don’t always have to repair our fathers mistakes to move on.
    One day we are going to have to put our pride aside and together say “What can we do for a better tomorrow”

    just my 2 cents

    Comment by david | Saturday, June 13, 2009 | Reply

  23. Thanks for the feedback David,

    But until we have true racial equality what you call the past I call current events. Day in and day out, by every social measure, the black community lags behind and pulls up the shitty rear across America. Lately, people have been talking about double digit unemployment and how it will affect the American economy. Well, the black community has been dealing with double digit unemployment for many months now and no one is talking about the negative impact to our community. Nothing is a problem until it affects the white community.

    So yes, I must agree it sounds wonderful to put racial differences aside and say that we are all Americans. But such a condition requires true equality across racial lines. That is something that simply doesn’t exist in America.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, June 13, 2009 | Reply


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