brotherpeacemaker

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God Knows When the Sparrow Died

Sparrow

Someone was trying to tell me how powerful and omniscient god was and said that god knew when a sparrow fell from the sky. My first reaction was to laugh, not because I thought this person was wrong. But I have to ask the question, why would god be interested in a sparrow falling out of the sky? I don’t know too many people who believe in god and don’t believe that he is all powerful and all knowing but are we so arrogant to believe that we rate that high on god’s attention meter.

The universe is a seriously vast entity. According to the simple human interpretation of the space and time continuum, the universe stretches from one side of infinity to the other and god is working across it all. Throughout all of this there are countless galaxies with countless stars with a number of planets with a countless numbers of individuals and plants and animals and god is supposed to expend his limitless power on knowing when one of the countless sparrows on this single planet buys the farm. If such a concept was uttered by a five year old it would be cute in its total simplicity. Such a notion would rank right up there with the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, the Great Pumpkin, the caring American, Peter Pan, Captain Crunch, and the like. As a people, we really need to do a better job developing our understanding of our relationship with the infinite being and grow out of the simple, feel good notions we learned back in Sunday school when we were knee high to our parents.

Our self importance in the cosmos knows no limit as well. If we are taught to believe that god is some voyeur all up in our business because we are just so special then it is a prime example of humanity’s self centered-ism at its finest. God gets furious about our adultery. God hates our active sex lives without marriage. God punishes the evil that people do and is ready to pounce because we’re all that and then some. People need to learn a little more humility. God is a busy Supreme Being. As I write this and as you read it god is building entire galaxies at the outer edge of the universe. Millions of planets need forming and countless species need planning. And that’s in this universe alone. There are other universes and other realities that need his attention as well. And he’s supposed to stop all this activity to take note of a little birdie that’s about to hit dirt.

Nobody may realize this but god knew that birds die when he added them to the mix of species on this planet. In fact, I would fathom a guess that god knows all of us are going to die. In god’s celestial plan the entire species of birds will one day become extinct. This very planet will one day cease to exist in god’s divine plan. As far as god is concerned, the entire zillion years of our planet’s existence is nothing but a sweep of the second hand on god’s celestial Timex. We have a tendency to think god is doing little more than standing ready to hear all our prayers and respond to them in mysterious ways. We pray to get the girl. We pray to win the game. We pray for a safe landing. We pray that our credit card works just one more time. We pray for a loved one’s health. Sometimes the prayers are answered Sometimes they aren’t. Who knows with god. One day he responds, the next day we’re left to our own devices.

But the truth of the matter is that god does little to interfere in our happenings. The mysterious ways that we were taught to believe in are little more than the happenstance of events allowed to carry on to their natural logical conclusion.

We may pray for god to save all the little children. But truth be told, if god wanted to, he could keep every child safe from now to eternity. But why would god be so moved to do so? God knows about people dying everyday and he allows it to happen. Why? As a people we already have everything we need to keep our children, our family, our community, and our world safe. As a collective, we simply choose not to. It’s always somebody else’s problem. Rich people could share their wealth with the people in need, but that would be welfare and no good for anybody because it was tried before and failed. But people forget, the very people who work hard to keep racism alive are the very same people who were in charge of the welfare program; the white mindset. God cannot be prayed into wanting to help us more than we want to help ourselves.

People use god’s name to manipulate other people. God isn’t in the business of granting wishes in the form of prayers simply because the one who prays is sincere. He’s not a genie. He’s a busy spiritual entity who has already given us all we need to do what our collective will dictates.

God hasn’t charged anyone to stop abortion. God has never charged anyone with the duty to invade another country and kill thousands upon thousands of people while friends coincidentally get rich robbing the national coffer. God didn’t abandon the people in New Orleans after hurricane Katrina.  People who were in the position to help but didn’t abandoned the people in New Orleans. God doesn’t have to save every child on the planet. We need to change our collective spirit so that we can develop a global community that truly wants to leave no child behind instead of using it as a catchy slogan to obtain a political office.

God has already answered our prayers. We have everything we need. We simply choose to squander it in a system wrought with favoritism and privilege for the few and indifference and struggle for the masses. This isn’t god’s plan, it is our plan. We’re either going to stick to it and let civilization rot or change it for the better. Quite frankly I don’t see things changing anytime soon. Our very existence may now be in jeopardy with global warming and we are too shell shocked from our day-to-day life to do anything to stop it. But as soon as the point is reached where it appears that divine intervention is the only thing that will save us we’ll pray for god to save us and wonder why he doesn’t and say it’s the lord’s will when in all actuality it is our will that doomed us.

God is all powerful and god is omniscient. If god wanted to, he’ll know exactly when, where, and how the sparrow dies. He’s just a little busy on more important things.

Monday, June 25, 2007 - Posted by | Black Community, God, Orisa, Philosophy, Religion, Spirituality

54 Comments »

  1. Man, you gotta love the world of blog. The place where millions of “wanna be journalists” around the world can make baseless, factless, unsupported claims without any research or reference at all and actually get away with it. Boy oh boy, where to start…

    You said, “Throughout all of this there are countless galaxies with countless stars with a number of planets with a countless numbers of individuals and plants and animals and god is supposed to expend his limitless power on knowing when one of the countless sparrows on this single planet buys the farm”

    There are not other individuals, planets, and animals in the galaxy except here on Earth. Nowhere in the Bible does it teach that there are other living things on other planets. So, why argue that God is busy dealing with so many other people in other galaxies when He has never claimed to do such things in His Word? Obviously, you haven’t spent much time in the Bible and your lack of evidence for the existence of anything BUT God has caused you to make baseless and completely unsupported claims as your evidence.

    You said, “God is a busy supreme being”

    Says who? You? Again, the Bible makes no such claim. In fact, it claims just the contrary. God, who spoke the entire universe into existence in 6 literal days, obviously won’t have that difficult of a time managing it all. But, once again, you prove your lack of evidence for the existence of anything BUT God and therefore have no other choice but to make baseless arguments simply because God doesn’t make sense to YOU. Just because us humans have a difficult time keeping everything afloat in our own lives doesn’t mean that God has the same struggles.

    You said, “As I write this and as you read it god is building entire galaxies at the outer edge of the universe. Millions of planets need forming and countless species need planning. And that’s in this universe alone. There are other universes and other realities that need his attention as well. And he’s supposed to stop all this activity to take note of a little birdie that’s about to hit dirt.”

    Again, says who?? The Bible has made it clear that God stopped creating on the 7th day. The Bible makes no claim that there are “millions of planets [that] need forming and countless species [that] need planning”. That must be your faith saying that. Here you, again, prove your lack of evidence for the existence of anything BUT God and therefore have no other choice but to make baseless arguments simply because YOUR FAITH says that there are other planets and species that need forming and planning. However, God has said no such thing.

    You said, “Sometimes the prayers are answered Sometimes they aren’t. Who knows with god. One day he responds, the next day we’re left to our own devices.”

    So, if things don’t turn out the way we asked for, then God has obviously not heard and not answered?? Or perhaps He was just too busy?? Spoken like a spoiled little child who’s never been told “No” before. Just because God doesn’t do what we ask for doesn’t mean He doesn’t answer. He did answer. And let us remember, that THE BIBLE SAYS, that God’s thoughts are higher than our thoughts and His ways are higher than our ways (Isaiah 55:9). So, if you want to attack from this angle you may want to throw in there that the Bible does not actually teach that God complies with everything we run by Him in prayer, but rather YOU THINK He should and therefore He is wrong or too busy because He doesn’t. It must be really easy to sit back and make such false and unreferenced claims about something you haven’t the slightest clue about. I have no idea who/what Ifa or Orisa is, but maybe I’ll write a blog article bashing him/her/it. Why not!?

    You said, “Rich people could share their wealth with the people in need, but that would be welfare and no good for anybody because it was tried before and failed.”

    Ahhhh! Now I’m understanding more. All the problems in the world are the rich man’s and capitalist society’s fault. But if the rich man just distributed his wealth cheerfully amongst others, all bad people would suddenly become upstanding citizens and utopia would exist. Or perhaps if trustworthy government officials such as Bill & Hillary Clinton, Al Gore, and George Bush (And perhaps even Hitler and Pol Pot for that matter) ran our lives?? Riiiggghhhhtt.

    You said, “But people forget, the very people who work hard to keep racism alive are the very same people who were in charge of the welfare program; the white mindset.”

    I agree to an extent actually. However, I would say “the LIBERAL white mindset” combined with the efforts of Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton, the ACLU, affirmative action, the [begin sarcasm]politically brilliant[end sarcasm] Kanye West, and other such people/programs that mean to “help” the seemingly incapable and oppressed black community. Interesting that it was mainly democrats who ran the KKK (Which informed blacks that they were incompetent by persecution) and now today it is democrats who push the Great Society, welfare, food stamps, and other such programs (Which do nothing more than inform blacks that they are still incompetent and need the government to sustain them). All the while, conservative white and black Americans are screaming “Blacks are just as intelligent and capable as anyone else. Let them get a job and exercise their abilities for crying out loud!” Remember that it was the ‘conservative republicans’, of their time, that worked to set the black man free from slavery for the very fact that they are not incompetent and deserve the equal freedoms that every other American enjoys. But, the liberal left will have all blacks believe that this isn’t the case and that they need the democratically driven government to sustain them.

    You said, “Our very existence may now be in jeopardy with global warming and we are too shell shocked from our day-to-day life to do anything to stop it.”

    Oh yeah, I forgot. God is some incompetent being, who’s far to busy creating new galaxies, and tending to the needs of other people in other galaxies to realize that His created Earth has failed and is killing His not-really-important humans here. Once again, the Bible has made it clear that God has created an incredibly efficient Earth, that the Earth is just fine and is not endangered of global disaster from our car exhaust. In fact, there is FAR more scientific evidence gained over the past hundreds of years to prove that the “global warming crisis” is a farce. Especially since any scientific study on “global warming” has only become popular since Al Gore decided to politicize it and fund it. Oh yeah, and Denver, CO, a global warming headquarters, just had a record freeze (That’s below 32 degrees Far.) for the month of June just this year. How strange! Also of interesting proportion is how much more thriving the area of the Exxon Valdez spill that was not touched by cleanup crews is doing than those areas with massive cleanup efforts. You can be rest assured that God created an amazing Earth that was built perfectly to sustain our lives. If massive oil spills, global floods (Which the Bible also makes claim to), hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, and on and on cannot end life here on Earth then no slight degree of warmth will kill us either.

    You said, “But as soon as the point is reached where it appears that divine intervention is the only thing that will save us we’ll pray for god to save us and wonder why he doesn’t and say it’s the lord’s will when in all actuality it is our will that doomed us.”

    WOW! I AGREE!! Indeed, it is our own will that has doomed us. In the beginning the utopia, that all people dream of, existed. The Bible explains it as the absolute perfect environment. An environment that man could never dream of. However, it was all screwed up when MAN chose sin. From there on, it has been nothing but trouble. Thorns grew from the ground, women’s child birth pains were greatly increased, and man had to work hard to sustain his life. This was a result of our choosing. We certainly did doom ourselves. It is for this reason that God will not miraculously save all the hurting and starving children in the world, remove cancer and all other illnesses, put an end to disastrous weather, and on and on. He gave us such perfection in the beginning. However, we chose to have rough. But thanks be to God that He gave His Son to die for us and provide us with a way to one day escape the tragic mistake we made and dwell in peace with Him in the afterlife. And indeed, there will come a day when every knee will bow and will no doubt beg God to save them. But it will be too late.

    So, you summed it up there at the end. If you could just realize this yourself, and stop attacking God and His Word with false claims that God has never made, then you too may come to know Him and His great love for you.

    Comment by oakley06 | Thursday, July 26, 2007 | Reply

  2. My blog is my opinion and not dependent on verification from some bible that you bought on Amazon or from Borders. You are more than welcome to agree or, obviously, disagree. But make no mistake I don’t need anyone to confirm my opinion.

    You ask who am I? I’m sorry but who the hell are you? You say god made the world literally in six days? As you yourself say, riiiggghhhhtt! You talk about scientific evidence and then say things like the world appeared out of nothing in six days and now god sits around and watch humans from his gold laced, marble La-z-boy. That in itself is worth a laugh or two.

    Who are you? You and your bible claim that god stopped working on the seventh day and now he’s just waiting to take his revenge out on people who don’t do what the bible says he’s going to do. Obviously you are one of those people who believe god is some sadistic voyeur with his finger on his seven shooter scroll trigger ready to cast everyone into hell. I’m sorry, everyone but you and people who think like you is what I meant.

    Contrary to your popular Christian belief the Christian bible isn’t the only holy book in existence. You feel the way you feel which is fine. You don’t agree with me is perfectly within your right. You believe that this so efficient Earth will go on supporting people because god made the Earth with an unlimited about of oil just waiting to be drilled out of the ground. The Earth will continue to support engineered vegetation that dies at the end of the year and requires the purchase of new seeds from Monsanto. The Earth will continue to produce everything we need as the population doubles every fifty years or so because everything will efficiently stay in balance. You really need to grow up and wake up.

    I have to agree with you. God did make the Earth perfect. It is people who move so well to muck things up as well as we do that causes the delicate balance of life to go awry. But if we know anything about humanity nothing happens in balance. Even a good dialog between people who have a difference in opinion can’t happen in balance. We have to go to extremes to prove points from our perspectives.

    God doesn’t need good people like you to protect him from bad people like me. If you believe so much in your bible then you should believe that one day I’ll have my day of reckoning with that lazy god of yours. But if your bible is to be believed then people like you shouldn’t be casting judgments lest they be judged. If anything god wrote those words to protect people like me from people like you who cannot tolerate anybody believing anything different.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Thursday, July 26, 2007 | Reply

  3. And you believing in the bible as a literal translation of the word of god is even more foolish. God made the world in six days is a preposterous proposition. But that’s your opinion. No matter how idiotic it is you’re entitled to it. You have no clue what god has said because if it isn’t written in your bible then you refuse to believe it. Say what you will about not casting judgments, but when you say my opinion is “mere foolishness” then you are the epitome of a Christian hypocrite.

    According to the big bang theory the matter that composes the universe didn’t appear out of nothing. It’s always been here. You wouldn’t know anything about that Ms. World Made In Six Days. Who said the bible is the word of god anyway? You are so quick to judge me, why don’t you prove to me that the bible is the word of god? Christians are getting sued so much probably because they are so quick to push their ideology on others whether it is welcomed or not.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  4. Yes, your blog is your opinion and having an opinion is one thing. But saying that God is so busy doing all of this stuff that He Himself has never said He does is mere foolishness. You’re making stuff up and claiming that God is too busy dealing with it. You call that opinion? If that’s the case, then the war against Iraq is 100% justified simply because Bush had an opinion that there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. And Hitler stands 100% justified for killing millions of Jews simply because he opined that they were worthless. Get my point?

    For example, you said in your original argument that God was busy dealing with other beings on other planets in other galaxies. Now, your opinion is that there are other people in this universe other than here on Earth. That’s fine if you want to believe that. However, God has never said this, nor has He said that He’s busy dealing with them. So to say that God is busy dealing with them is made up. It is a false, baseless, argument. That’s known as hogwash, not opinion.

    If you are going to attack God, the Bible, or anything else for that matter, doesn’t it make much more sense to attack what it actually says, using what it actually says, rather than making all of these wild and preposterous claims that God Himself never claimed?? You make yourself out to be a fool man. Why would someone ever take you seriously?

    And by the way, no, I don’t say the world appeared out of nothing in 6 days. That’s what people like you claim, except you say that this monstrosity of a universe went from absolutely nothing to something over billions and billions of years starting with some explosion of…oh yeah, nothing! I, on the other hand, say that the Almighty God of Heaven created it all. So, you’re the fool who says that something came out of nothing. I’m saying that this wonderful universe has been incredibly designed. No scientific evidence has been found to support your belief either. So it seems the laugh is on you my friend. At least we have a plausible explanation.

    And finally, I have cast no judgements. I’ve simply stated what the Bible says, which is the Word of God, which is what will judge all of mankind. And those words certainly were not written to protect people like you from people like me. They were meant to inform all of us what God expects if we want to have an eternity in Heaven. It’s not a matter of intolerance. It’s just a matter of me wanting to see as few as possible suffering for eternity in hell. So sue me. Seems to be the popular thing to do to Christians today because of intolerance against us and our beliefs/opinions.

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  5. Ok, let’s make this simple as honest debate is too difficult for you. You say that God is busy dealing with other people, on other planets, in other galaxies. As such, He is too busy to be concerned with dying sparrows here on Earth. Where do find your information that God is busy dealing with other people, on other planets, in other galaxies?

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  6. Obviously a nasty debate is all you’re capable of. Why don’t you prove to me that the bible is god’s word on Earth? Where do you get your information from?

    I already tried to explain to your wall of understanding that this is my opinion and I don’t have to prove anything to you. Who are you? As far as I know you are nobody I owe an explanation to. It is your opinion that god isn’t doing much of anything right now because he’s resting from all that work he did in six days. That is your opinion. But, when he made those sparrows didn’t he know they were going to die? Why would a dead bird get his attention now?

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  7. I get my information from the Bible! If I claim the Bible to be true, where else would I get my information from?? Make it up and claim it as my opinion as you do?? No. Instead, I have spent many many hours in deep study of the Bible to learn for myself that it is God’s inerrant Word. I need no other outside source to prove it is true. Nor do I need to make up things to disprove it as you do.

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  8. Well I guess that’s all I needed. Because you claim it so that just makes everything I believe wrong. I’m glad you straightened me out. I’m glad people like you are here to convert everybody to the Christian way of pulling absurd thoughts out of thin air and then making them true simply because you say so. That’s all the proof I needed. Thank you so much for helping me church lady. With good, convincing Christians like yourself around hell is really going to be one empty place indeed. May god bless you when he decides to get off his throne and do something other than rest.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  9. Well you know Oakley06, the bible was NOT written by God, since he nor Jesus came and wrote that book, so you are putting all of your knowledge in a book written by MEN. So I am sorry but you nor Brotherpeacemaker, nor I have all the answers. Everyone should be entitled to their own opinion, so why try so hard to make…no…FORCE him or anyone else to see it your way. I personally would like to know why you keep saying if the bible doesn’t say it then you don’t believe it, such as that the universe is continually growing. Well the bible doesn’t talk about new inventions like airplanes and the internet. Does that mean that they don’t exist either? Logic please. Let’s use some.

    Comment by theblacksentinel | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  10. No, it’s not because I claim it. It’s because the Bible claims it and verifies it. How do we know gravity exists? Simply because Newton opined it existed and decided to write a set of laws against it based on sometihng he made up? No, because Newton’s laws are able to be studied, tested, and verified. Therefore, one can say that his laws are true. Same with the Bible.

    I am already blessed by God, who isn’t sitting around on His throne doing nothing by the way (Yet another opinion of yours that the Bible never claims).

    Also, as a side note I’m a he, not a she. This making stuff up has really permeated your mind hasn’t it? 🙂

    Seriously, no harm to you was meant. I was just trying to find out where you were getting your info from in your attack against Christianity. Apparently us Christians have done something to really make you mad at us.

    At any rate, know that God loves you and cares for you and would love for you to love Him in return. Hence the Bible claiming that God is love. Hopefully, one day, you’ll study His Word and learn this Truth for yourself. Until then, I’ll leave you to your made up ideas as to why God is obviously not real. Take care and my regards.

    Peace.

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  11. It doesn’t matter that you are a man or woman. Church lady is a reference to a Saturday Night Live character that was always on the lookout for Satan. I appreciate your concern for my soul. But trust me, it is not in jeopardy. Like you I’ve spent many hours studying the bible. I know how to keep it in perspective. Maybe one day you will too. In the mean time, thank you for leaving me to my made up ideas. I will be more than happy to leave you to your “Bible claims it and verifies it” proof.

    But one last thing I’d like to share with you. Matthew 5:9. Knowing the way you think, if you read it in the bible, it must be true.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  12. It absolutely is. Every bit as true as Matthew 5:11-12.

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  13. Just like Matthew 7:1-5. Many forget this one.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  14. Especially verse 2 of this passage which tells me that I will be judged by the Bible since that is what I make my judgements by. Thank God that’s what I’ll be judged by, especially since I have no question as to wether the entirety of it is true or not 😉

    Comment by oakley06 | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  15. Of course you have no problem with it. You proudly wear your righteousness on your sleeve and pass judgments on others. It is very intriguing to see seemingly intelligent people pass rhetoric as proof and deny judgments they make in black and white.

    I have no questions about my validity with my beliefs. You are more than welcome to agree or disagree. But they are mine and I hold them dear. Your Christian beliefs are yours to hold dear and profess from your mountain tops. But you really need to spend more time studying Matthew 7:5.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, July 27, 2007 | Reply

  16. I just have a few comments for the both of you.

    First, I have absolutely no desire to get into a debate about beliefs. Rather, my only purpose for commenting is to bring back the whole point of this blog post. That being:
    “My first reaction was to laugh, not because I thought this person was wrong. But I have to ask the question, why would god be interested in a sparrow falling out of the sky?”

    Brother… I’m glad you asked. You stated that the idea that God would waste his time on such an insignificant creature is absurd. You feel that He has so much more important things to do and is “too busy”. I say you are right in that regard. A sparrow is a pretty insignificant creature, and that is the whole point of the scripture, which has not yet been quoted by either of you.

    The two of you were so busy quoting verses from Matthew that you literally skipped right through the heart of the matter; and matter of the heart is truly what we should be discussing.

    See Matthew 6:26 and again Matthew 10:29-31.

    The whole point of these verses is to illustrate that Our God of love loves us. Which answers your other question, “…but are we so arrogant to believe that we rate that high on god’s attention meter?”
    This is the point that is being over looked and misunderstood.
    You asked the question so please don’t be offended or defensive about me answering your questions based on the source of where this whole subject and idea stemmed from, the Bible.

    I’ll explain.

    In Matthew 10:29 Jesus rhetorically asks, “Are not two sparrows sold for a penny?”
    – He says this to remind us that WE place a price on these Birds, and that price is almost worthless if it takes two to equal one cent. But that is OUR view of the worth of these creatures. If He created them and us who are we to say what amount of worth He should place on them. Are we that arrogant to think that we, one of his creations, are more valuable than another one of his creations? I know that it is not our place to say what value God should place on His creations. But He does say how much more He loves us and Values us more than the Sparrow.

    Matthew 10:29 “Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father.” – He is going on to remind us that what ever happens on this earth He allows it to happen. Since you believe He created it, the idea that he can control it should be easy to agree with. Therefore, what ever happens… he allows. IE His will

    Matthew 10:30 “Yet even the very hairs on your head are all numbered”
    – The same God who created us knows everything about us, such as the number of hairs on our head. Since you believe He has infinite knowledge and wisdom than why would He not
    1. know the number of hairs on your head
    2. When a Sparrow falls to the earth.
    But you never said you didn’t think he wouldn’t know this. You said that you believe when He made them He knew they would die. So basically its not a matter to you that he knows, its why does he care. He cares because He made them, but I think more so to prove to us how much He cares for us.

    Matthew 10:31 “So don’t be afraid; you are worth more than any sparrows.”
    – This truly is the heart of the matter. The point God was getting to is to remind us that He made us and He loves us. Since He loves us we should not worry about matters that are out of our control. He painted a picture in Matt 6:26 how He provides for the birds. Now in this passage shows us how much more He loves us than birds. So since He said it, it isn’t arrogant for us to believe that “that we rate that high on god’s attention meter”.

    The point is if He loves, provides, and doesn’t let what isn’t His will happen to a bird we could care less about, than how much more does He Love, Provide, and look after us who he clearly claims in verse 31 that He loves.

    So the point of me commenting is not to argue with you, rather to answer your questions.

    Mostly, I just wanted to use this opportunity to share God’s word with you so that you can see the Bible demonstrates God’s love for us, His Creations. God loves you and created you to have a relationship with you. If you are going to question anything I urge you to let it be that.

    I’m not here to argue or condemn you or your ideas, just to share that bit of knowledge.
    I hope you have continued to read the remainder of chapter 10 because that is truly what the Bible is about… God’s love for us, and us accepting Him.

    I pray you continue to read the word of God and through it gain continual knowledge and wisdom. Proverbs 1:7

    Comment by james ramos | Saturday, September 15, 2007 | Reply

  17. I understand many people focus only on the word in the Christian bible as the only means of learning the nature of spirituality. But this is just one perspective. There are other perspectives of spirituality that should be embraced as well. I grew up a Christian. The rest of my family is Christian. To focus only on the Christian doctrine is not my interest.

    The Christian oakley06 came out the box judging me and I wanted to remind him that he should listen to the words of the bible he claims he adheres to. Although I keep my bible within arms reach, it is little more than a reference book for me. I have no interest in developing my spirit based on the word of somebody else.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, September 15, 2007 | Reply

  18. why so much noise and commotion about a simple and poetic opinion? let us be quiet for a moment and listen:
    “We need to change our collective spirit so that we can develop a global community that truly wants to leave no child behind instead of using it as a catchy slogan to obtain a political office.”
    a change of collective spirit…very wise indeed.

    Comment by a.b. | Monday, May 12, 2008 | Reply

  19. …and let us each be active in developing our own spirits, as brotherpeacemaker advises, before rushing to contradict others…

    Comment by a.b. | Monday, May 12, 2008 | Reply

  20. Thanks for the feedback a.b.,

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Monday, May 12, 2008 | Reply

  21. Brotherpeacemaker, I’m not wishing to debate either because I really don’t think anything that I say will make you feel any differently, but I would like you to know that as someone who has come across your blog, that I think you have an amazing imagination. No, don’t let that offend you. I really mean it- not a lot of people nowadays have a good imagination.

    I would also like to say that I would like to see Biblical proof (book, chapter, verse) to support your claims. I want to understand what you’re saying better.

    May God bless you.

    Comment by runningnotwalking | Thursday, June 12, 2008 | Reply

  22. Thanks for the feedback runningnotwalking,

    I will make the choice not to be offended by your feedback. But before I offer you biblical proof to support my claim, could you please offer me nonbiblical proof as to why I have to offer you proof or could you offer me any nonbiblical evidence that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the bible, a book that can be purchased from a variety of sources that have nothing to do with god, is the word of god. I would like to understand you better as well.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Thursday, June 12, 2008 | Reply

  23. Hi, BPM.

    I don’t quite understand what you’re asking, but maybe it’s just because I’m exhausted and need to eat.

    I’ll answer, but if I read you question in a way you didn’t intend, please do tell me.

    “I will make the choice not to be offended by your feedback.”
    I’m so glad- because I really AM interested in what you have to say.

    “But before I offer you biblical proof to support my claim, could you please offer me nonbiblical proof as to why I have to offer you proof[.]”
    Nonbiblical proof as to why you HAVE to offer me proof of what you’ve said? You don’t HAVE to offer me any proof. I’m genuinely interested in what you have to say, and if I’m wrong in how I understand the Bible, I would love to be corrected. You don’t have to offer me any proof at all, BPM- I just asked you because I want to know. I would hope that you would offer your evidence as a way to enlighten me.

    “[O]r could you offer me any nonbiblical evidence that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the bible, a book that can be purchased from a variety of sources that have nothing to do with god, is the word of god.”

    I personally believe that the Bible is the inerrant, inspired Word of God. Meaning that God didn’t come down and write it out on a scroll, but that he worked through certain individuals to have it on Earth.

    The Bible claims to be without error (I haven’t found anywhere that it contradicts itself, and I’ve looked REALLY hard!), to be authoritative, and sufficient to meet all of our spiritual needs. The Bible doesn’t defend itself- it only states truth, asking us to examine ourselves with what we read in the Bible.

    Reading through it, I’ve found that it’s scientifically accurate (Job 26:7 talks about the Earth being suspended on NOTHING at all- how did people way back then know that? When most people thought we were this flat thing, and if you went far enough you would probably fall off?), and that it teaches some pretty amazing things!

    In 2 Timothy 3:16, it reads: “All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness.”

    Jesus said “I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?” (John 3:12)

    I believe that the Bible is the inspired Word of God, because of prophecies foretelling Jesus Christ HUNDREDS of years before he was born, telling that He would be born from a virgin, and that He would be rejected.

    Psalm 22 prophesies about the crucifixion of Jesus. Remember that this was written about 1000 years before Jesus was born- and it happened! The writer couldn’t have known this all on his own!

    Even archeology supports the accuracy of the Bible from ancient ruins to cities mentioned in Scripture! (If you read Joshua 8, it talks about how Ai (meaning, “Ruins”- weird name for a city to have, huh? I thought so, too, when I found out the meaning) was burned, and how it stayed in ruins, and how it still IS in ruins to this day.

    On a website I recently ran across, it says:

    “First of all, there have been thousands of archeological finds in the Middle East that support the picture presented in the Bible. For example, narratives about the patriarchs -Abraham, Isaac, Jacob- were considered legendary by many, but with more corroborated evidence there is little question about their historical accuracy. The destruction of Sadom and Gomorrah was used by many skeptics to describe a mythological representation in the Bible. Since then, evidence has been uncovered that all five cities mentioned in Genesis are, in fact, situated just as the Old Testament said. As far the cities destruction goes, archeologist Clifford Wilson said that there is “permanent evidence of the great conflagration that took place in the distance past.” The cities have been located and their destruction fits exactly with how it is reported in the Bible.

    “Furthermore, EVERY reference to an Assyrian King in the Old Testament has been proven correct. Regarding the Jews return to Israel (previously used by skeptics as a point in the Bible with lacking evidence), an excavation during the 1960’s confirmed that the Israelites could have entered Jerusalem by way of tunnel during David’s reign. In fact, the persuasive evidence leads archaeologist to conclude not only that this is a possibility, but that it is likely exactly what happened. Another part of the Bible that skeptics charged with being mythological is the amazing Solomon’s temple. Solomon’s temple is now being excavated. Every time an archaeological discovery is made in an effort to refute the Bible it ends up validating it!

    “The Old Testament has about three dozen references to people known as the Hittites. Skeptics used this as a claim that the Bible is not accurate because there is no evidence that these people ever existed. Archaeologist digging in Turkey have now discovered records of the Hittites! Archaeologist William F. Albright stated, “There can be no doubt that archeology has confirmed the substantial historicity of the Old Testament tradition.”

    “Prophecy of Sidon

    Ezekiel warned the city of Sidon that the inhabitants would be decimated but that the city would continue (Ezekiel 28:21-23). Lets look at the fulfillment of this prophecy. Historically, Sidon was decimated, it was betrayed by its king. 40,000 inhabitants were killed leaving the city virtually empty, but Sidon still exists today. Some may say that this prophesy is vague and that anyone could have guessed and got it right, but consider this, when it was prophesized, Sidon was a great city, no one would have thought that this could ever happen. If you still think this is vague, take a look at the prophesies of Tyre.

    “Prophecy of Tyre

    Tyre was one of the greatest cities on the eastern Mediterranean cost. It was declared that Tyre would be destroyed, never to be rebuilt, never to be inhabited again. “They will destroy the walls of Tyre and pull down her towers; I will scrape away her rubble and make her a bare rock. Out of the sea she will become a place to spread fishnets, for I have spoken, declares the Sovereign Lord… and they shall throw your stones, timber and rubble into the sea… I will make you a bare rock and you will become a place to spread fishnets. You will never be rebuilt, for I the Lord have spoken.” ~Ezekiel 26:4-5, 12-14

    “Historically, King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon brought his army to Tyre. Tyre withstood Babylon for 13 years. Finally the walls of the city crumbled and Babylon’s army came in and whipped out the city. Thousands fled the city by boat to an island half a mile off the cost. They rebuilt the new city of Tyre with huge walls all around it. By this the prophecy was only partially fulfilled… so far.

    “Later, Alexander the Great set out to destroy the Persian Empire. He sealed off the ports of the eastern Mediterranean and the cities on the cost surrendered one by one. When he got to Tyre they laughed at him. Alexander and his chief engineer Diades decided to build a causeway across the ½ mile stretch. Where would they get the materials to do this? Alexander issued “Tear down the walls of Tyre, take the timbers and the stone, the rubble and the logs, and cast them into the sea.” These are the same things that were prophesized! Alexander crossed the causeway and completely leveled Tyre and killed all of its inhabitants. If you were to travel to Tyre today, you would see nothing at all because there is nothing left of the city. What you would see is the spreading of nets on the island where Tyre used to stand. Because of its perfect location out into the water, fishermen use it as a place to spread and clean their nets.

    “Prophecy of Babylon

    There are over 100 specific prophecies about the fate of Babylon in the Bible. Babylon was the greatest city in ancient time. It had the most beautiful architecture and was the most scientifically advanced city of its time. Babylon was 196 square miles enclosed by walls. These walls were 187 feet thick at the base and stood 200 feet tall. The towers from the walls stood 300 feel tall. The city was like a fortress, nearly impenetrable. While Babylon was the greatest city in the world, the prophet Isaiah said, “And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the splendor and pride of the Chaldeans, will be like Sodom and Gomorrah when God overthrew them.” (Isaiah 13:19). The prophet Jeremiah said, “The broad walls of Babylon shall be leveled to the ground… it shall be desolate forever.” (Jeremiah 51:58,62). Can you imagine what people must have thought when they heard this? The Great Wall of China is not nearly as large or strong as the walls of Babylon were, but it is older and it still stands today. The walls of Babylon were destroyed but only gradually, the city still remained. But Julian the Apostate, one of the greatest opponents of the scripture, fulfilled this prophecy. He destroyed the walls of Babylon so that the Persian army could not use them for protection in the future.

    “But that is not all that the scriptures say about this great city. Jeremiah says, “Because of the wrath of the LORD she shall not be inhibited, but shall be an utter desolation… she shall never again be peopled, or inhabited for all generations.” (Jeremiah 50:13,39). The salt and the sand where Babylon used to stand make the land so that nothing could ever grow there today. Alexander the Great, one of the most powerful men ever to live, wanted to rebuild the city of Babylon as the capitol of his new kingdom. He ordered the city built and issued 600,000 rations to his soldiers to do so. Shortly after this Alexander was suddenly found dead. Plans to rebuild the city were called off and forgotten about.

    “Still not convinced? There is more about Babylon. Consider these two seemingly contradictory prophecies, both predicted by Jeremiah. “The sea has risen over Babylon; she has been covered by its tumultuous waves.” Jeremiah 51:42. The second prophecy follows immediately describing Babylon as “a land of drought and a desert, a land in which no one lives” Jeremiah 51:43. I bet even Jeremiah was confused when had to report this one! But lets look at Babylon today. Claudius James Rich describes this one pretty well: “For the space of two months throughout the year the ruins of Babylon are inundated by the annual overflowing of the Euphrates so as to render many parts of them inaccessible by converting the valleys into morasses.” After the water subsides even the lowest valleys become dry desolate desert. All expectations after the fall of Babylon were that the city would be rebuilt, where every city of Chaldea that had been destroyed was rebuilt. But the scriptures said that Babylon would never be rebuilt and 2500 years later the city is now a barren wasteland.

    “God promised that the walls of Jerusalem would be rebuilt; that the walls of Babylon would never be rebuilt; that Tyre would be destroyed; and that Sidon would continue. I believe that God gave us these 2000 plus fulfilled prophecies so that we would have evidence in order to believe in Him.”

    I think that’s pretty amazing.

    The Word of God has power. Hebrews 4:12 says, “For the word of God is living and active…” It has power to reveal a sovereign God. The Bible exposes our need for a Savior, as we contemplate its words and look at our own hearts.

    The Bible was written to prepare the way for a Messiah who would die for our sins. The Bible is an open invitation for mankind to come to Jesus, so we can find love, purpose, redemption, and a relationship with Jesus Christ.

    “I would like to understand you better as well.”
    I’m so glad we’re in agreement, BPM! I’m always willing to learn more about nearly everything (always about religions- it really interests me), and I think you may be able to help me in that.

    May God bless you.

    Comment by runningnotwalking | Thursday, June 12, 2008 | Reply

  24. runningnotwalking,

    I appreciate your response to my query. But I was asking for non-biblical proof that the bible is the word of god. You listed a great deal of Christian bible scripture. But it is all biblical references. If you believe that the bible is the true word of god then it isn’t a problem to believe that everything written in it is the word of god. But on the other hand, if you are trying to convince someone who may be skeptical about the authenticity of the bible as god’s word then someone quoting scripture may not actually be the best way to convince the nonbeliever.

    The way I understand it, the bible is a history book filled with excerpts from a number of writers. I would expect a history book to be accurate. If its not then it is a work of fiction and we must ask ourselves why are we bothering to study it so much?

    There are other writers of ancient verses who have not been added to this list of bible authors. For example, the scripture according to Judas is not included in the bible nor the scripture according to Mary Magdalene. While it is a common belief that Judas betrayed Jesus and then ran off to kill himself as depicted in Matthew 27:5, the scripture according to Judas appears to be evidence that Judas not only survived the crucifixion of Jesus but wrote about the event from his own perspective. The fact that Judas had time to put pen to paper and spread his own verses should be one example of some of the human influence to manipulate scripture.

    To add insult to injury the bible has gone through translations and through many interpretations and reinterpretations so that the accuracy of the original scripture may not be as correct and free of translators prejudice as it should be.

    I find if difficult to be inspired by a book written three thousand years ago about things that happened two thousand years ago. I would be much more impressed if the bible was making more timely prophesies. And if the ability to predict prophesy is a factor for inclusion then why not added the gospel according to Nostradamus? Many people claim that Nostradamus predicted many events such as the collapse of the World Trade Center. But nobody is saying that Nostradamus is man of god and his writings should be added to the Christian bible. Therefore, I can only conclude that there is a specific and narrowly defined set of criteria of what is acceptable for inclusion.

    For me, the bottom line is that there are many more authors with spiritually inspired writings that are not included in the bible than those who are included. I believe I would be severely limiting myself if I only accepted the writings of the bible as the only source for spiritual inspiration.

    Back in Sunday school, I learned that the Christian god knows all. He is omniscient. But for some reason the bible is full of examples where god has to test the devotion of various bible characters. Genesis 22 tells the story of Abraham and Isaac where god wants to test Abraham’s devotion by telling him to sacrifice his son. Coming from a god that is supposed to know all and a god that is supposed to love people and provide for people, this sounds seriously cruel. Imagine what you would feel, how you would feel, if god came to you and told you to murder your only son. Imagine how heavy that burden would feel. And then you discover god, who already knows your heart, wants to put you through unnecessary grief. If god knows all why does he have to subject people to such cruel testing? Why is god so insecure that he requires such confirmation and assurances?

    In my own talks with god, I have found him to be anything but the insecure Supreme Being that I learned of in Sunday school so many years ago. The god that I have had the pleasure of communing with is quite comfortable in the knowledge of who he is and what he is. The god I know isn’t addicted to praise and prayer, especially not from anything as fickle and deceptive as the average human being. God isn’t about proving his sovereignty over anyone. That would be like somebody going around trying to prove to ants how sovereign he or she is. It’s truly not important for anybody to rule ants just trying to go about their day. It’s not important for the Supreme Being to rule over us.

    You believe in the bible. If that truly works for you then you are truly fortunate. However, the word of god didn’t stop when the last period was made in the book of Revelations. I believe that spirituality continues to inspire us on a constant basis if we would just take the time to remove all distractions, sit still, and open our minds to it. I find it difficult to develop spirituality when I allow myself to be relegated to the spirituality of the words in the bible written three thousand years ago. That was somebody else’s spirituality put to paper in a totally different time. What does spirituality have to say about the now?

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Friday, June 13, 2008 | Reply

  25. “But the truth of the matter is that god does little to interfere in our happenings.”
    Sweet that you write of sparrows, a little bird whose chirps and cheeps and warbles brighten your day when unexpectedly heard on almost any day. We “interfere” in those little ones’ lives when we toss out crumbs, seed or fruit to fill their little bellies; as we do that, God is doing that. As we reach out in giving some street person, really, more than we can afford, God is doing that. As we care about any other living thing, God is doing that. Thank you for such a sweet blog and, I too, wish Senator Obama well and pray for both him and his dear grandmother.
    :Gerry Spencer, Chicago Illinois.

    Comment by Gerald Spencer | Tuesday, October 21, 2008 | Reply

  26. Thanks for the feedback Gerald Spencer,

    And just like we interfere with sparrows when we throw bread crumbs their way, we interfere with them when we drive our polluting cars and destroy paradise to put up a parking lot.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, October 21, 2008 | Reply

  27. You are totally wrong about God and His creation! if you think you are so good and can prove that God isn’t real try creating everything so awesome and good and complex! If you can’t than stop going around trying to preach to everybody that God isn’t real because He is.
    Hope you read the Bible and truly understand how awesome God really is and start preaching to people about his wonders.

    Comment by anonymous | Thursday, February 19, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback anonymous,

      But I have a suggestion for you. Why don’t you actually try reading the article? When you’re through, could you tell me where I implied or explicitly stated that god doesn’t exist. It would be appreciated.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Thursday, February 19, 2009 | Reply

  28. By the way, i’ve had this bookmarked for over a year. I loved reading it the first time and i still enjoyed it when i read over it again today. I just thought i would get around to posting my appreciation over it.

    It’s a shame you’ve recieved so much hatemail based off what is basically blind loyalty towards the Christian faith, without actually trying to understand your ideas and thought process over the statement you heard.

    I have wanted to post responses to each criticism you have recieved citing scientific sources proving points they have asked for, in my own frustration to their narrow mindedness and ignorance, but have feared i would start an needless internet based religious war (of the many thousands that already exist) that would just go in circles. Of which i had no will to provoke nor finish. Such is the fanaticism of the subject at hand.

    Keep on truckin’ my friend.

    Comment by Sam | Friday, June 26, 2009 | Reply

  29. Thanks for the feedback Sam,

    It is a shame that people want to hold on to their beliefs so strongly that they will attack anyone who expresses a belief that runs contrary. The last thing I need is to attack everyone that doesn’t follow my belief system. But I like to think that I have more respect for others people’s beliefs to just go to their site and start spewing my rhetoric.

    Now that that’s out of the way…

    Thanks for coming to my blog! And don’t wait so long next time to chime in. And feedback is always welcome, even if you disagree. Just keep it respectful is all I ask.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, June 27, 2009 | Reply

  30. Brotherpeacemaker, ask God yourself.
    All opinions, all intellect aside, call out to Him on your own without these debates in mind.

    Pray out loud without sarcasm, with a genuine heart and soul, that you know He exists, (because I see that You believe He does exist), and ask Him to open your eyes to what He has for you.
    It is impossible to receive from God if you rely on your own knowledge of who He is and what His will is. You must take the Bible as His Word, and test it. If you ask Him anything with wholeheartedness, God promises to give you something in return.

    Luke 11:9
    9″So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 10For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.

    11″Which of you fathers, if your son asks for[f] a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”

    If you want to understand, you have to seek the one who created it all. The great thing is, He waits for us to seek Him and test Him. He is only wrathful when evil has injustly come against Him and his people (us who love Him). He is most of all a loving Father that wants you to be happy in Him, because He knows what truly fills you with joy despite who you are, what you’ve done wrong, or what you think. God surpasses it all, and its why we praise Him, because He loves us and knows us individually. Test Him yourself.

    1 Thessalonians 5
    16Be joyful always; 17pray continually; 18give thanks in all circumstances, for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus.

    19Do not put out the Spirit’s fire; 20do not treat prophecies with contempt. 21Test everything. Hold on to the good. 22Avoid every kind of evil.

    23May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.

    Comment by Ally Bash | Sunday, October 11, 2009 | Reply

  31. Gee, all this is funny. Obviously you guys have plenty of time to sit in front of the computer and fling things at each and give me a couple of hearty laughs, while leaving God to be busy with His gigantic universe. If He has “time” to read this blog and sees a few humans worth a truckload of sparrows arguing about how He spends His time or even whether He exists, or when and where one can find His “spoken” word, I bet He too will be amused .

    Comment by PAM | Tuesday, December 15, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback PAM,

      Seems like you have a little time on your hands yourself. You’d be surprised at how amused god gets. After all, wouldn’t the Supreme Being have the supreme sense of humor?

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, December 15, 2009 | Reply

  32. Hi brotherpeacemaker

    Hey I do not have to agree with your imaginations on what or what not God is doing ,or who He is or who He is not. Belief in God is a very personal matter and you can believe whatever you like to believe about Him.
    I do however agree with some of your other views. Yes, we do stuff to destroy things around us, do not care for each other and waste things while so many have so little. Yes, God has given us a bountiful earth, but only a few enjoy it (way too much) and billions suffer without even enough food to fill their bellies. We live such comfortable lives and are so indifferent to the needs of the others, but when something happens to them or to us, the first question (generally) is “oh where is God”, or “why did God allow this”. God is the great scapegoat when things go wrong and life becomes uncomfortable for us.
    I’m sick of seeing most of the rich western nations use up so much of the earth’s bounty in a totally irresponsible way. I have met a number of Americans (in Australia) who just take their clothes from the washing machine to the dryer, when there is bright sunshine just outside the laundry room. Is the dryer really necessary in sunny weather? Gloomy, wet days are another issue, but come on, use the freely available “God provided” sunshine to dry your clothes rather than tapping into the limited amount of energy available to the whole world.
    Most of the rich are callous and indifferent to how much of a carbon footprint they leave on earth. Just because they can afford it, and can do it, they do things, without the slightest concern or worry about the wastage now, and the dire consequences to the whole world later on.
    Oh ye foolish!!!!

    Comment by PAM | Tuesday, December 15, 2009 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback PAM,

      I’m glad you feel free to believe what you want about god despite the fact it might look like a big fairy tale to a more rational person. I do believe we should learn more respect for each others beliefs. Unfortunately we spend too much time condemning others for not believing what we believe to the letter. All the while, we don’t even practice what we profess to believe in. Goodwill towards all men? Don’t even go there.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Tuesday, December 15, 2009 | Reply

  33. I do respect the right of anyone to have any belief system and I certainly do not go on to call some of them “fairy tales”.
    I’ll leave that to people who are more ‘rational” like you. As I have observed on many occasions, the ones who cry out loud for tolerance for other people’s beliefs are the least tolerant and the most hypocritical of us all.

    Comment by PAM | Wednesday, December 16, 2009 | Reply

    • PAM,

      Really? You’re the tolerant one? You refer to my belief system as “imaginations on what or what not God is” and this makes you the tolerant one. But it is exactly as you said, the ones who cry out [loudest] for tolerance are the same ones least tolerant of others.

      Basically, I have no clue what your belief system is. I have no clue if it is a fairy tale or actually built on a rational understanding and appreciation of spirituality. What I do know is that I may have struck a chord and you feel like your belief system really doesn’t have a foundation of reality to stand on. But that’s okay. No one can prove their spirituality to another. If we could, it wouldn’t be called faith.

      The fantasies that I was referring to were the people like oakley06 who want to believe that the universe was literally created in six days, six 24 hour periods. Another good fantasy is the belief that Jesus was born of immaculate conception. And all these beliefs are real to a lot of people because the Christian bible said so.

      Good luck with whatever irrational belief system you have. Sounds like you don’t believe your god is big enough to take a jab or two. And if that’s the case, maybe you should be more careful with the jabs you make.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Wednesday, December 16, 2009 | Reply

  34. Dear BPM –
    Stumbled on your blog while looking for a picture of sparrows, and would like to leave a wee word.

    First, the whole point of the Bible’s existence is to point men to Christ, as any methodical reader can see. However, such a reader can also see that Jesus never offered Himself to anyone who did not want Him. Now, the sum of these two facts is this: Except as an accademic exercise, everything that has been said here about the veracity or otherwise of the Bible is totally pointless unless you (in this case) feel a need for Christ and what He can do for you. If you do not, there are many other subjects you would doubtless find more profitable to ruminate over.

    However, if by God’s grace you ever come to a place in your life where you realize that, living in God’s moral universe you are guilty before Him, then you will discover that there is none but Christ to help you. If you have any doubts as to Christ’s uniqueness in this regard, the argument of Romans 3:10-31 establishes it to the satisfaction of most thinking people. But again, the beginning place is not whether the Bible is true; the beginning place has to be, “Have I sinned against God, and what can I do to be saved from the consequences?” – Matthew 1:21

    Comment by Mac | Thursday, December 31, 2009 | Reply

  35. Thanks for the feedback Mac,

    I’m glad you believe in your bible and in Jesus Christ so much. Obviously you feel a need for Jesus and you should feel free to do so. And people who do not feel that need should be just as free to do what they see fit as well. By the grace of god, I have moved past the lessons I learned in Sunday school to cast a more critical eye to Christianity. This is not to say that Christianity is wrong for the person who believes it is right for them. Romans, nor any other book in your bible, is by itself enough to satisfy anyone who examines Christianity with a careful eye. In order to believe the words in the books of the bible, you have to have an understanding and a belief that the bible is something other than just a book. You believe it is the word of god. I believe it’s a book you can buy in a bookstore for seven dollars or so. I do not believe I have committed any sin against god. I do not believe I have the ability to incur god’s wrath. When it comes to the Supreme Being of the universe, I just don’t see me being that important where he has to cast judgment on me. You believe you’re that important to god. More power to you. But the idea that the Supreme Being is taking such a personal interest in me is ludicrous. I just don’t think that highly of myself.

    Peace

    Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Thursday, December 31, 2009 | Reply

    • Dear BPM,

      It is true that the logical axiom of Christianity is the Bible, for without the Bible, even the word God is undefined and therefore meaningless. However, you also cannot escape the Bible, because it is impossible to think logically about anything without borrowing from a Christian worldview. This is starkly true when it comes to any question of morality.

      You make a number of statements here: 1) “I do not believe I have committed any sin against god.” Yet you know you have, for the law of Moses, which you say you disbelieve is written by the Creator on your own heart. You knew it was wrong to lie, but because of your corrupt nature, you did it anyway. The same goes for stealing, despising you fellow man, and so on. No sane human claims to have never done wrong, and yet the question as to WHY it is wrong cannot be answered apart from God.

      2) “I do not believe I have the ability to incur god’s wrath.” Being a morally conscious creature who has violated his own conscience, why would you not expect to be punished for it? You certainly expect justice to be done when others do it – why not you? Why should you expect God to ignore your sins?

      3) “When it comes to the Supreme Being of the universe, I just don’t see me being that important where he has to cast judgment on me.” Adam also wished he was not so important when he hid from God in the garden. A burglar wishes he wasn’t so important to a policeman.

      4) “The idea that the Supreme Being is taking such a personal interest in me is ludicrous.” Did Da Vinci or Rubens take a personal interest in their creations? Why would One who made something so intricate and wonderful as you not take an interest in you? Why would He not be grieved by the things you have done that perverted His purposes for you?

      Take care.

      Comment by Mac | Saturday, January 2, 2010 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback Mac,

      But either you’re not listening or you simply refuse to believe what I have to say. I’ll say that I have not committed any sin against your god and you simply refuse to accept my word. So let me try to get my point across another way…

      I do not believe in your god. If I don’t believe in your god, I find it difficult to believe that I can offend your god. I do not believe in any law of Moses. I do not believe that Jesus is anybody’s lord or savior.

      I find it offensive that you feel that I’m lying. Based on what? If anyone is lying it is you. You are doing your best to mislead yourself and unfortunately others into thinking the bible is the only key to morality. You talk about morals but it is truly hard to believe that you have any understanding of what it means to be moral or socially conscious. People don’t need your bible, your god, or your lord and savior to develop social values. Black people had a moral social structure long before your Moses or Jesus ever walked the earth. If you need your bible to be moral then that’s your own issue.

      Hopefully for the rest of us, if you actually do need such a pacifier as your bible to develop a sense of morality then please keep your good book close at hand. Lord knows what type of hell raising individual you’d be without it. However some of us have enough character to exercise our self control without the need for such crutches. We are of good character and treat others with good character because we want the same done to us. You assume that people who don’t believe they commit sins against your god are saying that they don’t do wrong. Is that something else your bible tells you? If so then it’s just another indication of your faulty thinking process. And let’s not even examine the number of people who wave their Christian bible around while they lie, cheat, steal, murder and plunder. What’s that about? The way you make it sound, anybody who reads the bible will be too sane to do sin against god.

      Lastly, in your analogy, you compared god to a policeman. Let’s examine that for a second. It is a policeman’s job is to catch burglars and people who break our social laws and not the laws of Moses. Protecting the law is the reason for a policeman’s existence. The policeman works on behalf of his community. The mayor, the governor, the president, the teachers, the doctors, and many others don’t worry so much about catching burglars because that’s the policeman’s job.

      Is it your contention that the only reason your god exists is to catch burglars or the people who break Moses’ law? If so then your god is really small and somewhat petty. He can create a universe but has nothing better to do than to stick his nose into my business. And your god being the god that hates sin enough to cast people into hell for eternity is intent on doing things the hard way. If god has to wait until people die to do something about the crime and sin that he hates so much then he really is intent on doing things in a very dumb way.

      When you really stop and look at what you’re saying from a logical perspective, without all the blinding fluff of Christian fueled adoration with little respect for the beliefs of your fellow non-Christian, you and your version of god are pretty lame.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, January 2, 2010 | Reply

      • BPM –
        The only reason I came back to you is that I care about your soul. However, If you ask me to stop posting here, I will bother you no further.
        Unfortunately, there is a tendency to emote when we should be thinking, especially when it comes to spiritual things, but unless we do begin to think and reason properly, we can never experience true peace ourselves, let alone be a true “peacemaker”.
        – Mac

        Comment by Mac | Saturday, January 2, 2010

      • Thanks for caring about my soul Mac,

        But like I said before, you simply refuse to understand that my soul is not in jeopardy. While I appreciate your concern, it is your arrogance wrapped in your Christian worship that is unwanted. If you cannot comment here without your superiority complex then it would be best that you move on. I always think about things from a spiritual perspective. I would suggest that you follow your advice and think about your spirituality rather than go on about the simplistic version of spirituality that you read about in your bible without thinking.

        Feel free to come back after you’ve given your spirituality a good thought. Come to peace within yourself and you may find peace with the peacemaker as well as others. Please note that even the peacemaker is allowed to take offense when a jerk attacks and calls him/her a liar.

        Peace

        Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, January 2, 2010

  36. Hi,

    Sparrows are living plenty in Kurnool district of Andhra Pradesh state, India.

    Comment by Suresh Kumar Gogune | Sunday, March 28, 2010 | Reply

  37. Personally…I loved this. Superb!
    I think it funny, that the human species think they are so important and superior..conquer everything, are materialistic, selfish and destructive.
    The only ones that came close to living as intended were many othe indigenous as they respected the earth, took only what they needed, were grateful and gave thanks to the sacrifice of all species that enabled them to survive. They did not hoard, rape the earth contaminate the water or spread disease. They were sensible and knew they were part of a web not the web itself and as such lived in harmony. They did not claim ownership of the land but rather part of it.
    Then the greedy so called god fearing ones come along…try to civilize them and with them they brought disease, greed, filth, poor habits, they rape the land, claim ownership, disrespect other species and obliterate them…yup gotta love em…not.
    The people who take the Bible as the only sacred truth are foolish. The person who made the comment that god stopped creating after the 6th day…that referred to the earth …not the whole universe. Creation happens continuously. If you want to take the Bible that literal..don’t forget where it says…God will bring to ruin those ruining the earth and the only species doing that is humans! So put that in your pipe and smoke it.
    People also have a warped perception of who or what God is. They view the creator in the only way they know how…they humanize. Has it ever occurred to anyone that some things may have been worded so simple minded humans could understand a concept?
    The Bible says God is love, and love does this and would not do that…that humans were supposedly made in his image if that were true they would live a life of love and would treat each other accordingly and would also treat the earth with respect as they were given commission to care for the garden..you know they one they paved with a parking lot.
    I could go on and on…
    Loved your perspective and thanks for writing it.

    Comment by Rebecca | Sunday, May 9, 2010 | Reply

  38. Laughing, and to think I only came to this page to view your photograph of the sparrow lol I find the voracity with which some people have responded quite humorous.

    Comment by Rebecca | Sunday, May 9, 2010 | Reply

  39. Guess you hit a spark here. So many comments! I also tend to feel that in the scheme of things we human beings aren’t expecially important, but I honestly hate to give up the “sparrow falls” quote simply because it seems so poignant and beautiful and suggests to me that even the smallest life matters somehow. It’s not that I have any opinion about what god knows or doesn’t know, but I do hope that it’s true that life matters.

    Comment by Bettina Hansel | Sunday, May 9, 2010 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback Bettina Hansel,

      Welcome back! You’ve been missed…

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Monday, May 10, 2010 | Reply

  40. Man, I only click on this site to fugure out how to rid my yard of sparrows…

    Comment by Bill | Monday, May 10, 2010 | Reply

  41. I enjoyed this post.
    I’ll say this at the start: on these matters, you and I are a bit different. Evidently you believe in a deity of some sort whereas I do not.

    But when it comes to the actual events of our day to day lives, we ARE similar. What happens is basically a mixture of chance (e. g., earthquakes) and our own actions (genocides, human made disasters and climate change, etc.) And it is really up to us to learn how to get along, create vaccines, find cures for diseases, etc.

    A cold blooded analysis of history will show this: belief in spirits have been around for a long time and the current Bible has been around for about 1700-1800 years or so. But we only made advances against diseases, child mortality, etc. when science has stepped in, period.

    Stuff like prayer might well comfort the person praying, but it isn’t going to cure a disease nor stop a disaster.

    Comment by blueollie | Tuesday, May 11, 2010 | Reply

    • Thanks for the feedback blueollie,

      It’s not important that we believe the same things from a spiritual perspective. But one thing that is important is that regardless our beliefs, that we come together and work together for the betterment of our communities and not just sit back and pray that things are going to happen to improve our way to improve our collective. Prayer might be a comfort for some. But people shouldn’t let the comfort of prayer pass as an effective substitute for the hard work of making change with our own hands and minds and hearts.

      Peace

      Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Wednesday, May 12, 2010 | Reply

      • I have no desire to get into an argument or anything but if you truly desire to know if the Word of God is really 100% true, I challenge you to ask God to reveal Himself to you. If you really do want to know the truth, He won’t deny you that. Doesn’t mean it will happen over night and it won’t be something necessarily miraculous but over time you’ll see. I challenge you to just ask Him. What’ve you got to lose?

        Comment by Lauren | Thursday, May 2, 2013

      • Thanks for the feedback Lauren,

        What makes you think I have not met god? What makes you think that god hasn’t revealed himself to me? I’m quite comfortable with the relationship I have with the Supreme Being. However, I could suggest the same to you. Why don’t you ask god to reveal himself to you? Why don’t you open yourself up to him. Maybe then you wouldn’t take such a naive perspective and actually learn something.

        Peace

        Comment by brotherpeacemaker | Saturday, May 11, 2013

  42. All I was looking for was what kind of bird is at my feeder.

    Having always been fascinated by religion and the passion with which people argue their own viewpoints, I thoroughly enjoyed the above debate. I’ll come back again when I have time to read it more fully. Until then, thanks. And I wish peace and happiness to you all, regardless of the source of that peace.

    Comment by Simone Hopkins | Monday, May 17, 2010 | Reply


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